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Isk

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:40 pm

Morlock, were you using sh40 or sch80 PVC? My experience with 5' x .5" sch40 was pretty flexy and the 3/4" PVC is too big around for my taste.

Have you checked out the fiberglass tubes from McMaster-Carr or Ice Falcon? A 20' x 1" or 1.25" for $40 is a pretty good price (since you live near PHX).
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Morlock

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:49 pm

McMaster-Carr was the name of the south cali supplier. Ice Falcon never gives the overall length and thus I tend to ignore them completely.

To speak on terms that I can follow along with, I use the white .5" pvc at 5 feet. Never had one flex more than 90 degrees. I also add fins to the tail end (flat pommel actually)
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Isk

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed Apr 14, 2010 3:37 am

Interesting. I have had a 1/2" white pvc (that's normally sch40) fail flex at just over 4', but that was 15 years ago. Since then I have always used 1/2" sch80 (the dark grey stuff, can be found in 4' lengths with threaded ends) or, preferably, fiberglass. I guess we'll just have to disagree on the suitability of 1/2" white PVC for javs.

Ice Falcon would be twice what you'd pay the people you found in Phoenix, plus shipping. I'd say you've got a good option there. What's the OD on the 20' tube? I'd probably be happy to pick one up (cut into 10' chunks, please) from you at an event this summer if you do order some.
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Morlock

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed Apr 14, 2010 3:46 am

yes, .5" pvc will fail a 45 degree flex, but as javs conform to the 90 degree check, 5 feet of .5" pvc is fine.

The Guy in PHX quoted me $40 after I told him what I wanted. A 20 foot fiberglass tube that wouldn't snap in half if a 200lb person fell onto the center of it. I would think it would be around 1.25" OD. And that was in '09. Before I found collapsible flag poles and pole vaulting equipment.

I'm still working on padding a collapsible spear. Here's hoping I can finish it for Yestare...
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konradr

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:42 am

The fiberglass tubes you guys are talking about from Ice falcon, is that the red poltruded fiberglass the SCA uses for their spears? That's some thick fiberglass and expensive.

Morlock, I was in Lowes and they carried the dark gray Schedule 80 PVC in 10 foot lengths. Seemed pretty thick walled. I believe it was an inch or more in diameter, I can't remember now. I lifted it up adn shook it. It flexed a bit, not too much. I was looking for a flag pole and ended up buying a 1/2 inch metal one from the electrical section.

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Isk

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed Apr 14, 2010 3:43 pm

Yeah, those are the ones Konradr. And if you are going to use PVC, the sch80 will last longer although it's heavier.

Morlock, I was referring to the jav flex test, but like I said, it's been 15 years since I made one from that material. Maybe it had flexed out after being used.


Last edited by Isk on Wed Apr 14, 2010 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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konradr

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed Apr 14, 2010 5:30 pm

I usually use the 48" sch 80 PVC risers for Jav's. They are stiff at first, but do start to flex after awhile and just keep on flexing til they fail. The heat here especially is murder on PVC of any kind.

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 3:18 am

Hey all! I went to Lowes and they have the 48" driveway markers. I bought for of the Orange ones. They have yellow ones and orange ones. I don't know the difference between them other than the color and the price. The orange ones are $1.99 each and the yellow ones are $1.97. I don't know why one would be three cents cheaper, so I shook them and the orange ones seem to flex less, or maybe it was just my imagination, so I bought 4 of those. They seem thinner than the gray rods K'urn had given me, but I will try them out.

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Isk

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 5:48 pm

I actually stopped by lowes this weekend as well and I couldn't find any square markers. The had yellow and orange ones that sounded like what you're describing Konradr, but weren't there supposed to be some square ones? Those orange ones still looked too thin to me and I didn't grab any.
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 9:55 pm

I've never seen square ones, I was talking about the round ones. I'd have to see them to tell whether or not they were the kind i was talking about, however, though they are thinner, they are not meant to be stand alone core. You have to dual core it. And I swear to you, it works, most of the swords back east are built this way.
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 10:00 pm

Google maps says we don't have any Tractor Supply stores. However, I used to find them there, and I used to get really heavy duty gray ones from there.
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Isk

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 10:05 pm

That's square cores you found at tractor supply stores or heavier round cores? I can probably find something like that.
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Mon May 03, 2010 10:20 pm

heavier round core. I managed to make a minimum red out of these ones I had. They are very sturdy compared to the other ones. But like I said, alone they will bend, but when you bind the two rods together, they aren't going anywhere.
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Demie Zephyra

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 6:21 am

I got some of those driveway markers as well.

Caretaker, can you tell me the best way to stick 'em together?

Since they're round...I have no idea what I'm doing. o.O
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 7:10 am

I think he said he duct taped together and that was it. Smithy recommends using shoe goo to glue the two together after taping. I think I might do the shoe goo and duct tape the ends and the middle then use strapping tape tightly around the whole core before starting on the foam.

However, I'm not sure they are sturdy enough even with two, so I'm thinking of making a triple core and seeing how that works out.

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 7:25 am

IF it bends....I dont think those are the right ones.... Im unsure of the size but they have to at least be 3/8's in Dia.

A strong bind of duck tape in strips up and down the cores always has worked fine for us. However, if you dont pressure it, the cores will eventually seperate. However if you put enough strips tight enough, my sword passed for over a year, no joke. The only thing i ever had to replace was the cover:D
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 7:30 am

PS. I am open literally almost all week long. I am always willing to help buy materials and/or build with people. We can go over to your places or we can make a spot in my garage:D
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 4:41 pm

I'm terrible at sizes, maybe 3/8 maybe smaller??? They are not whippy. I have to hold one in both hands and really push/pull to have them bend a little, they don't bend into a U, just a little flex. I think doubled they may be fine, or tripled.

Since you and Demie live on the same side of town, maybe she can show you the ones from lowes and you can help her with a sword. cheers

I'll experiment. I have lots of repairs and remakes to do when I have time.

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 6:05 pm

Two of these driveway markers side by side (doubled) make slightly over 1/2". I think they would work for a small sword. 28", maybe 30"?

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 7:28 pm

I decided to triple core mine. I took 2 of the driveway markers and cut to 28". I put one of the 20" left over pieces inside the other two. I cut about 8 inches of the other 20" piece and put that in the middle at the end. That will be the hilt area. I shoe gooed them and duct taped them together then put side strips of duct tape on the whole core. The three cores feel about right.

I put leather strips on both ends and taped in place with duct tape. Now I am going to put strapping tape over the entire core and then tomorrow I will put on the hilt and pommel then foam the blade.

I will use masking tape to build up a comfortable grip then finish with red cloth tape. The pommel and blade will all be made with blue camping mat foam and double sided duct tape. Will let you know how it comes out tomorrow.

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Demie Zephyra

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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 9:18 pm

I used two driveway markers, duct taped the ends, put some plumber's sealant along the creases, and then taped them in a spiral all the way down.

There's very little flex and they seem to be holding together wonderfully.
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Tue May 04, 2010 9:36 pm

You go guys ;D its good to see weapons getting made and passable before Yestare, Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed May 05, 2010 7:30 am

The fact that everyone is making weapons on their own now is fantastic. The dual fiberglass rod method is real easy and cheap though the colored rods I have found have too much flex for my tastes. Although in Demie's defense I have never used plumbers sealant (though I do know its properties) which may offer much more rigidity so I can't wait to see it. BTW Demie, Whispers sword is almost done and will be at practice on Saturday. As will Stefana's, Heretic's, and my new reds.
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed May 05, 2010 3:05 pm

O.o Whisper's sword? You made her one?

Haha. Yay for new weapons!
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PostSubject: Re: size of fiberglass....   Wed May 05, 2010 3:31 pm

Isk wrote:
For 1/2" and 3/8" round, call around to ranch supply places. What you are asking for are electric fencing rods. I would try I F A Country Store (702) 837-1755 for the 3/8" and maybe the 1/2". 3/8" round is good for a finished sword out to about 27", after which it'll generally fail for flex.

We've been discussing the driveway markers, but did you guys try IFA or any of the other ranch supply places in your area to get electric fencing rods? That's our primary source of solid fiberglass rods so we don't have to get those over the net.
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